Travis wrote: Does Tyson do the thing where he turns into "Robo-dog" when the tennis ball comes out? Luna almost can't process information correctly when there's a tennis ball present. It always cracks us up to see her get that blank look and just track the the tennis ball left to right like some kind of possessed dog robot. Won't eat grilled chicken or steak even if there's a tennis ball around, etc. It's ridiculous. We have to ban them from the house and only bring them out for on-field exercise and flyball.
Tennis ball = immediate OCD focus. However, I will say that Tyson loves food more than his tennis balls... Luna wins the "tennis ball addict" award!!
~Stacy
Mom to:
Tyson - DS mix (Hendrix's Soul Sibling and Dinga Roo's long lost twin)
Baby Ruth - Miniature Schnauzer
Snickers - Miniature Pinscher http://www.rescuedme.org
Talk about a "white elephant award" lol Makes it almost impossible to use as a motivator for anything other than flyball and chasing the next tennis ball. It actually slows down her response time for cementing behaviors compared to food or other toys. Or even for reinforcing her existing obedience like sitting or lying down for the ball compared to more traditional "drivey" dogs that aren't just completely OCD about them.
Tell us about yourself: DS and Mal foster newly approved aug'12 by NADSR and ABMCR. high-functioning Autistic in nyc/hamptons in my 60's. Rescued the smartest dog i had ever seen off nyc street in 2000. Tracedog's intelligence exceeded by multiples my judgement that day. My first [and only as of 10/2012] dog turned out to be a DS, perhaps with a touch of something else, but attention to detail, behavioral traits, and physical habits, movement, and skill identical to DS. But MUCH more intellectual ability. supremely confident in all settings, fearless, very outgoing and social with people and friendly with dogs. Seldom apart in over 12 years, Trace Dog was the most important relationship of my adult life; he was my partner. He died july17,2012. i am dying without him. www.youtube.com/tracesobakawww.dogster.com/dogs/637612
hi Gingerman, i thought reading your last post that you had decided based on various behavioral traits that Ginger was not a purebred DS. was my reading of your post not correct? you also said [ i think ] that she had lost a few pounds - which got me thinking that if she is over-weight, maybe that is distorting her look in the photographs. in the end, without show-pose photos, it is very difficult to rely on photos as i have said all along. like statistics, they can be made to indicate almost anything. some of you photos - especially earlier ones - showed no DS; others have looked very DS to me. so i remain very open-minded as to whether she is a mix. but i tried in my last[?] post to indicate that the devil is in the detail. the photos are inconclusive; i may feel differently in person, but specific behavior, attitude, movement is the key. only you see and experience that. no matter how much she looks like a DS possibility, if the rest of the package is not there, then she is not one; on the other hand, if there is no daylight in behavior between her and DS, then referencing DS is helpful no matter how unlike a DS she may look in person. you were not specific about your observations in this regard, but they seemed mixed. for better or worse, it would take some real-life exposure to DS and to Ginger to develop a REALLY informed opinion, but reading TONS of detail of peoples' past lives with their DS on this forum can sure give you a pretty good sense.
i got the weight thing in that post you made - and indeed ginger was at [ within !]the top of the female range. do you think she might be overweight? can you feel her ribs EASILY? if not, she should lose more weight and maybe more of a DS figure will appear. is her ribs can be easily distinguished, then well.... a friend of mine currently with 6 [7?] purebred DS and Mal has had some very big DS, including one male now that is 125LB. [ and i thank you again for posting that.] unlike GSDs, most DS fall in a very narrow weight range, with outliers being fairly uncommon. so in your photos where the tuck, the ears, etc., look non-DS, then weight becomes another clue. weight by itself is not the point.
the discussion of false advertising [ as it was labeled, but was about advertising, true or false, and public awareness ] was just a caution to you. Ginger sounds like an absolutely wonderful dog; she must be vERY special. and it sounds like she may be so special that strangers rave about her. if you say she is a DS [ whether she is or is not ] and that makes people seek one out, most of those people would wind up with a demon-dog that winds up in a shelter of worse. for the most part, DS are VERY DIFFICULT dogs to live with and train. i think many DS - far out of proportion to their numbers in the dog population - wind up in shelters for just this reason. this is what scares all of us. i hope you noticed, that advertising discussion became an internal conversation about how best to handle inquiries and perceptions; it even spawned another thread devoted to the topic. you motivated the first comment, but most of the discussion was not about you. so relax.
like Sakima, Ginger sounds like she is not some possessed demon. in Saki's case, it is one more thing that says to me that SAKI is not really purebred despite being from a DS breeder. that is not to say a DS must be that way, but it requires some luck to skip the ''possessed'' traits and a whole lot of luck if your talking a DS from a shelter where the shelter and/or pre-shelter experience is likely to have done immense damage to a purebred DS.
anyway, Stephanie wrote a very nice post welcoming you to be a regular. settle in and enjoy sharing experience and advice. we can all learn more about Ginger and her degree of DS-ness over time.
Tell us about yourself: I am a mom of 6 life forces - 2 kids and 3 dogs 1 hamster. I live in Ct. I have trained Ringsport and Agility and have 2 DS, one 15 and 7 and a Basset Hound Cookie who is 2
I think this thread has run its course, by the fact that you are now calling us ignorant. You continue to shove wrong information in our faces and try to force us to say yes to your belief that Ginger is a DS when clearly she is not. How many years experience do you have with this breed? How many years have you trained a working sport with them? To come here with no experience with this breed and tell us we have no idea what we are talking about is quite arrogant. People come here for information and love to stay because this is a happy place to be to share stories about or dogs. Many people with mixes or just other breeds stay because it’s a fun place. You are not, at this time, contributing to the fun atmosphere of this board. I have enough experience and training under my belt with this breed to clearly state she is NOT a Dutch shepherd.
You have all of the answers here from people with tons of experience with this breed, it is not our problem that you don’t agree, or don’t want to see the truth. You can post all of the info you want, you can find every inch in every corner of the internet, that still wont change our opining here that she is not a DS. SO if you want to continue being a Right Fighter, maybe you should choose another place.
This has been fun, folks, but it's become like the debate of: if a tree falls in the woods....
If we're not learning something--and honestly, we're not--then it's time to put our energies elsewhere, wherever that may be.
Later tonight, this thread will get locked. R.I.P.
Though I can only hope to become the person who my animals believe I am, the things that they have taught me have made me a better human being. ~~~Sharon~~~
Tell us about yourself: DS and Mal foster newly approved aug'12 by NADSR and ABMCR. high-functioning Autistic in nyc/hamptons in my 60's. Rescued the smartest dog i had ever seen off nyc street in 2000. Tracedog's intelligence exceeded by multiples my judgement that day. My first [and only as of 10/2012] dog turned out to be a DS, perhaps with a touch of something else, but attention to detail, behavioral traits, and physical habits, movement, and skill identical to DS. But MUCH more intellectual ability. supremely confident in all settings, fearless, very outgoing and social with people and friendly with dogs. Seldom apart in over 12 years, Trace Dog was the most important relationship of my adult life; he was my partner. He died july17,2012. i am dying without him. www.youtube.com/tracesobakawww.dogster.com/dogs/637612
OMG - i cannot believe how many posts were made in the time it took me to type [ a word with loose meaning for me ] my last post.
stranger things have happened [ i guess]: i am afraid i have been less ruffled by this thread than most - maybe even a bit amused - AND even learned a little. but it probably is time to end it; don't see it going anywhere from here.
i guess i have been willing to consider that Gingerman may just be VERY wound up [ DS-style! ] about his great dog and has often come off as obnoxious. maybe he'll stick around and promise [ at least to himself ] that he won't call us ignorant again.
and Sharon! what a great topic. LOVE chocolate! i know everyone does, but i am truly committed to it. at the least, i eat several tablespoons a day of cacao powder - so i mainline with the stuff! LOL
In general, the un-registered KNPV Dutch Shepherd is a larger dog (males can
reach over 70 cms at the shoulder and weigh up to 55 kgs, while females can
reach over 65 cms and weigh up to 40 kgs) with larger bones and head size than
the FCI registered dogs. They also commonly have a far more highly and widely
regarded working character than the Dutch Shepherds bred solely to FCI
standards. "
40/55kg - approx 90/120 lbs....
Well I guess my 42lb unregistered KNPV line female with grandparents and above that have actual KNPV titles is not a working line Dutch Shepherd according to this website...
Stephanie
'Odin' NV PTA Odin of Another Kingdom RL1
'Elli' Drawing Our Own Constellations RL1 CGC CGCA
Tell us about yourself: I am a mom of 6 life forces - 2 kids and 3 dogs 1 hamster. I live in Ct. I have trained Ringsport and Agility and have 2 DS, one 15 and 7 and a Basset Hound Cookie who is 2
Tell us about yourself: I am a partnered male who spends my time caring for my ailing mother. I was angry when my sister told me she brought home a stray puppy (I live with her), But upon meeting Ginger my heart melted. I loved my Valkyrie so much (A german shepherd Rott mix), I never thought I would meet a dog so sweet, smart, and beautiful, but there she was. I have no papers but I thing Ginger is the dutchiest dutchess in dutchland.
I have repeatedly almost given up on this thread and site because of childish and nonsensical posts by people claiming to know my motivations (they are not even remotely close), but then someone will make a post that I think is worth responding to and I get sucked back in, like someone asking where I got the weight information which I already posted, so I re-post it and then I get something like "you're just piking and choosing posts to confirm what you want to beleive." NOOOOOOOOOOOO, I was responding to a request. The couple of links I posted are the tip of the iceburg. YES I have read the posts and learned things, the most important is how difficult DS can be, and I do believe this, and has given me pause about describing Ginger as a DS to people that I meet, especially because there are several websites out there I have not listed that say things like "DS can be loving family pets", and put DS lower on the intensity scare than other shepherds, and that really is a concern. There is also the issue of others independently pegging Ginger as a DS, this has happened three times. If I tell people Ginger seems to me to be a DS mix, I will qualify it by saying "but dont get the wrong idea, if she is she is WAYY on the mellow side, they are usually a handful" Fair enough?
But I agree, this thread is pointless. I came to this website with an open mind and no agenda whatsoever, even if the title of this thread indicates otherwise, and I was taken aback when people seemed to have such a chip on their shoulders. So I give up. Sorry to those that have been welcoming, there are too many others that have been the opposite and have soured me on the whole site, so good luck to everyone and have nice lives, BYE!
Though I can only hope to become the person who my animals believe I am, the things that they have taught me have made me a better human being. ~~~Sharon~~~
Facebook page.
Does Tyson do the thing where he turns into "Robo-dog" when the tennis ball comes out? Luna almost can't process information correctly when there's a tennis ball present. It always cracks us up to see her get that blank look and just track the the tennis ball left to right like some kind of possessed dog robot. Won't eat grilled chicken or steak even if there's a tennis ball around, etc. It's ridiculous. We have to ban them from the house and only bring them out for on-field exercise and flyball.
