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centrop67
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Tell us about yourself: Accidental DS rescuer. Human companion to Radar and Leela. Owner of the site, looking to make this the top site for information and discussion on Dutch Shepherds.
Location: Cutler Bay, FL, USA

DNA Test

Post by centrop67 » Fri Oct 13, 2017 12:46 am

Just caught a post on one of the Facebook groups. It looks like they've added Dutch Shepherd Dogs to the Wisdom panel.

Thoughts?

If you rescued would you consider the test now?

Best part for me was the Facebook poster's dog is named Radar.
Michael
The pack -> Radar (DS), Leela (Mal?), and Karen (Human) - Cutler Bay, FL USA
RIP: Tequila and Snickers
If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went. - Will Rogers

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centrop67
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Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2012 3:42 pm
Tell us about yourself: Accidental DS rescuer. Human companion to Radar and Leela. Owner of the site, looking to make this the top site for information and discussion on Dutch Shepherds.
Location: Cutler Bay, FL, USA

Re: DNA Test

Post by centrop67 » Sat Oct 14, 2017 1:16 pm

https://www.wisdompanel.com/wisdom-panel-4-0/ wrote:The Wisdom Panel 4.0 Canine DNA Test covers you with information to plan for your dog’s unique nutrition, training and even healthcare. Results provide you with:

Identification of purebred ancestors present in the first three generations (to the great-grandparent level)
A predicted weight profile
Information about the physical traits your dog may exhibit
Testing for the MDR1 genetic mutation
Testing for Exercise-induced Collapse (EIC)
Breeds

wpBreeds.jpg
wpBreeds.jpg (152.19 KiB) Viewed 991 times
Michael
The pack -> Radar (DS), Leela (Mal?), and Karen (Human) - Cutler Bay, FL USA
RIP: Tequila and Snickers
If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went. - Will Rogers

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Dutchringgirl
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Tell us about yourself: I am a mom of 6 life forces - 2 kids and 3 dogs 1 hamster. I live in Ct. I have trained Ringsport and Agility and have 2 DS, one 15 and 7 and a Basset Hound Cookie who is 2
Location: Ct, USA
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Re: DNA Test

Post by Dutchringgirl » Sat Oct 14, 2017 5:21 pm

I saw that post. I dont know if I would bother because I would not care. but I know many people do
Lisa, Thalie CGC & Sadie, Cookie the Basset, CT
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centrop67
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Posts: 1433
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Tell us about yourself: Accidental DS rescuer. Human companion to Radar and Leela. Owner of the site, looking to make this the top site for information and discussion on Dutch Shepherds.
Location: Cutler Bay, FL, USA

Re: DNA Test

Post by centrop67 » Sat Oct 14, 2017 5:43 pm

As a public service to the forum, I've purchased a test for both Radar and Leela.

(Also, I'm curious) :mrgreen:

Results coming soon...
Michael
The pack -> Radar (DS), Leela (Mal?), and Karen (Human) - Cutler Bay, FL USA
RIP: Tequila and Snickers
If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went. - Will Rogers

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centrop67
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Posts: 1433
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Tell us about yourself: Accidental DS rescuer. Human companion to Radar and Leela. Owner of the site, looking to make this the top site for information and discussion on Dutch Shepherds.
Location: Cutler Bay, FL, USA

Re: DNA Test

Post by centrop67 » Mon Oct 23, 2017 12:34 pm

Cheeks swabbed - kits out in the mail today.

Should have the results in 2-3 weeks.
Michael
The pack -> Radar (DS), Leela (Mal?), and Karen (Human) - Cutler Bay, FL USA
RIP: Tequila and Snickers
If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went. - Will Rogers

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Location: central MD

Re: DNA Test

Post by TimL_168 » Mon Oct 23, 2017 9:56 pm

:wtg:
Tim L.
Aurora(Shiloh) Endeavor

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centrop67
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Location: Cutler Bay, FL, USA

Re: DNA Test

Post by centrop67 » Sat Oct 28, 2017 4:08 pm

Progress...
WisomPanelRadar.jpg
WisomPanelRadar.jpg (61 KiB) Viewed 910 times
WisomPanelLeela.jpg
WisomPanelLeela.jpg (62.91 KiB) Viewed 910 times
Michael
The pack -> Radar (DS), Leela (Mal?), and Karen (Human) - Cutler Bay, FL USA
RIP: Tequila and Snickers
If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went. - Will Rogers

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centrop67
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Posts: 1433
Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2012 3:42 pm
Tell us about yourself: Accidental DS rescuer. Human companion to Radar and Leela. Owner of the site, looking to make this the top site for information and discussion on Dutch Shepherds.
Location: Cutler Bay, FL, USA

Re: DNA Test

Post by centrop67 » Mon Nov 06, 2017 8:28 pm

Radar's results are in :wtg:

50% DS
25% Mal
25% GSD

Would he still be eligible for the Photo Contest? :huh:

Ancestry_Radar.jpg
Ancestry_Radar.jpg (42.4 KiB) Viewed 871 times
Michael
The pack -> Radar (DS), Leela (Mal?), and Karen (Human) - Cutler Bay, FL USA
RIP: Tequila and Snickers
If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went. - Will Rogers

Steve Gossmeyer
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Re: DNA Test

Post by Steve Gossmeyer » Tue Nov 07, 2017 12:33 am

centrop67 wrote:
Mon Nov 06, 2017 8:28 pm
Radar's results are in :wtg:

50% DS
25% Mal
25% GSD

Would he still be eligible for the Photo Contest? :huh:


Ancestry_Radar.jpg
By those genetics he’s considered a Dutch Shepherd!

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centrop67
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Posts: 1433
Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2012 3:42 pm
Tell us about yourself: Accidental DS rescuer. Human companion to Radar and Leela. Owner of the site, looking to make this the top site for information and discussion on Dutch Shepherds.
Location: Cutler Bay, FL, USA

Re: DNA Test

Post by centrop67 » Sat Nov 11, 2017 7:55 pm

Still waiting on Leela's results... :whistle:

In the meantime, I have a code for $15 dollars off a test kit. First to respond gets it.
Michael
The pack -> Radar (DS), Leela (Mal?), and Karen (Human) - Cutler Bay, FL USA
RIP: Tequila and Snickers
If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went. - Will Rogers

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centrop67
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Posts: 1433
Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2012 3:42 pm
Tell us about yourself: Accidental DS rescuer. Human companion to Radar and Leela. Owner of the site, looking to make this the top site for information and discussion on Dutch Shepherds.
Location: Cutler Bay, FL, USA

Re: DNA Test

Post by centrop67 » Sat Nov 18, 2017 5:23 pm

Well, I got bad news on Leela's results. Apparently, I didn't get enough DNA on the swabs for them to analyze.

Leela's breed was more in question to me, so this is frustrating. I was pretty certain about Radar.

So, now I have to do it again and wait.
Michael
The pack -> Radar (DS), Leela (Mal?), and Karen (Human) - Cutler Bay, FL USA
RIP: Tequila and Snickers
If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went. - Will Rogers

Kenda
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Tell us about yourself: Hi from Oklahoma! I have 2 outstanding Dutchies, a snarly dachshund, and 3 horses! I love long walks on the beach.. oops wrong kind of about section! ;) Seriouslyy though, I'm kinda new to the breed, just about a year, and we love taking our animals on trips, hiking, etc.
Location: oklahoma

Re: DNA Test

Post by Kenda » Wed Dec 13, 2017 1:29 am

I’m very intrigued by this DNA test. I think I’ll get it done as well! Did you do the full panel for genetic diseases?
Kenda/mom/pack leader
Mike/OH/pack leader mate
Lovie/snarly 7 year old dachschund who sleeps, eats, pees, and snarls
Shadow/ gorgeous 9 month old puppy Dutch Shepherd female
Max/newest pack member, 4-6 year old male Dutch Shepherd

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centrop67
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Posts: 1433
Joined: Mon Dec 03, 2012 3:42 pm
Tell us about yourself: Accidental DS rescuer. Human companion to Radar and Leela. Owner of the site, looking to make this the top site for information and discussion on Dutch Shepherds.
Location: Cutler Bay, FL, USA

Re: DNA Test

Post by centrop67 » Wed Dec 13, 2017 3:19 pm

Kenda wrote:
Wed Dec 13, 2017 1:29 am
Did you do the full panel for genetic diseases?
Yes I did.

UPDATE ON Leela's screening...
I sent out the new screening yesterday. It's not because they took so long to get me the new test. It's just I sat on it for a while. In fact, the company has been really great on responding and keeping me informed all the way through the process.
Michael
The pack -> Radar (DS), Leela (Mal?), and Karen (Human) - Cutler Bay, FL USA
RIP: Tequila and Snickers
If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went. - Will Rogers

Kenda
Just Whelped
Posts: 12
Joined: Tue Dec 12, 2017 10:42 pm
Tell us about yourself: Hi from Oklahoma! I have 2 outstanding Dutchies, a snarly dachshund, and 3 horses! I love long walks on the beach.. oops wrong kind of about section! ;) Seriouslyy though, I'm kinda new to the breed, just about a year, and we love taking our animals on trips, hiking, etc.
Location: oklahoma

Re: DNA Test

Post by Kenda » Wed Dec 13, 2017 3:36 pm

Well, I’m ordering tests today! For both my dutch pups! I can’t wait! :DSangel: :DScool: :stickman:
Kenda/mom/pack leader
Mike/OH/pack leader mate
Lovie/snarly 7 year old dachschund who sleeps, eats, pees, and snarls
Shadow/ gorgeous 9 month old puppy Dutch Shepherd female
Max/newest pack member, 4-6 year old male Dutch Shepherd

Boaz1
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Tell us about yourself: I am a dog groomer with my own shop. In July I got my first Dutch Shepherd and am very impressed with him.

Re: DNA Test

Post by Boaz1 » Mon Jan 01, 2018 11:44 pm

I had the Wisdom panel done on Boaz and I have to say, if I am reading the ancestory tree like you would read a normal ancestry tree, I do not believe them. The results show he is 37% plus Dutch Shepherd, an equal amount German Shepherd, and the rest equally divided between Belgium Malinois and BOXER. They show both his parents were three way crosses. One was half Dutch Shepherd, one quarter each German Shepherd and Mal. The other parent was one half German Shepherd, one quarter each Dutch Shepherd and BOXER. Boaz is showing in his phenotype absolutely nothing but Dutch Shepherd. Coat color and type, ears (except one ear stands straight up only when he is completely alert, otherwise flops at the tip the other is perfect), eye shape and color, muzzle shape, body size and shape, tail----all are pure Dutch Shepherd. I have emailed Wisdom about this but have not heard back yet.

I can believe German Shepherd and Mal would show up in him but farther back than his parents. Any ideas/comments?

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centrop67
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Location: Cutler Bay, FL, USA

Re: DNA Test

Post by centrop67 » Tue Jan 02, 2018 1:15 pm

Leela's results are back. According to the results, she's mostly a GSD. I am a little perplexed by the results - but it's probably because they didn't turn out as expected.

She's 50% GSD, and then equal mixes of Akita, Labrador Retriever, American Staffordshire Terrier, and "other".
Ancestry_Leela.jpg
Ancestry_Leela.jpg (42.67 KiB) Viewed 581 times
I am skeptical, because there is little evidence in the eye test of GSD at all, but I guess the other combinations could wash that out. It's just that the other combinations are relatively large bulky breeds of which she also shows no signs.

gsd.jpg
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akita.jpg
akita.jpg (33.45 KiB) Viewed 581 times
AST.jpg
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lab.jpg
lab.jpg (3.35 KiB) Viewed 581 times
Leela:
Leela.jpg
Leela.jpg (140.84 KiB) Viewed 581 times

As Wisdom describes how they come up with the results, I see that there's room for error:
Widom Panel wrote:The algorithm uses information from our extensive 12,000+ purebred sample database to analyze your dog’s potential pedigrees and determine which one is the best fit. It gives each of the millions of possible combinations a score based on how well it matches your dog’s data. The tree with the overall best score is selected and represented here.
A three generation tree is is "scored" and the best score wins. Leaving out other potential matches. If their database doesn't have a better matching tree it's possible to miss something. Therefore, the more mixed and/or rare the breed, the harder it is for them to be accurate. <- Just my opinion, but I think the math would support it.
Michael
The pack -> Radar (DS), Leela (Mal?), and Karen (Human) - Cutler Bay, FL USA
RIP: Tequila and Snickers
If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went. - Will Rogers

Boaz1
Just Whelped
Posts: 16
Joined: Wed Jan 20, 2016 12:36 am
Tell us about yourself: I am a dog groomer with my own shop. In July I got my first Dutch Shepherd and am very impressed with him.

Re: DNA Test

Post by Boaz1 » Tue Jan 02, 2018 7:52 pm

I find it very strange that no Belgium Malinois showed up in Leela. Looks very Mal to me. . Still haven't heard back from Wisdom. Will post if/when I do.

Boaz1
Just Whelped
Posts: 16
Joined: Wed Jan 20, 2016 12:36 am
Tell us about yourself: I am a dog groomer with my own shop. In July I got my first Dutch Shepherd and am very impressed with him.

Re: DNA Test

Post by Boaz1 » Tue Jan 02, 2018 11:27 pm

Photos of Boaz can be seen on intheneighborhooddoggrooming.com if anyone wants to take a look and tell me if they see any other breed in him. He is on each page of site except "about me" page. In first one he is four months, in the others a year and a half. He will be three in April.

Boaz1
Just Whelped
Posts: 16
Joined: Wed Jan 20, 2016 12:36 am
Tell us about yourself: I am a dog groomer with my own shop. In July I got my first Dutch Shepherd and am very impressed with him.

Re: DNA Test

Post by Boaz1 » Thu Jan 04, 2018 11:36 pm

Heard back from Wisdom on Boaz' s results. The test can pick up things from way back and the more rare the breed the harder it is to be accurate. Both Mals an GSD were used o come up with a heavier DS and a consistent brindle in the short hair after th e y were no longer primarily used as sheep dogs. Evidently the mix with GSD was disasterous and wasn't done very long. In any case Wisdom seemed to focus on the brindle in Boaz saying brindle is dominate and that explained everything. Even though I told them everything about his appearance is DS, nothing else except possibly Mal. I don't think the percentages necessarily mean anything. They may sometimes, sometimes not. And yes, probably a person will only believe the results if they like them! Still think Boaz would show some evidence of what they say he is. He looks and acts like a Dutchie!

So-----if as anybody is out there, would love to hear comments.

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centrop67
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Location: Cutler Bay, FL, USA

Re: DNA Test

Post by centrop67 » Fri Jan 05, 2018 1:03 pm

Boaz1 wrote:
Thu Jan 04, 2018 11:36 pm
So-----if as anybody is out there, would love to hear comments.
It probably would be helpful to post pics of Boaz here. I know some members aren't big fans of links, but that may not be the only reason.

Anyway, after looking at the pics on your site, I notice the coloring is more "splotchy" than "stripey". I read somewhere (possibly here on the forum) where brindle is strictly a stripe pattern, so that may be evidence of another breed that disrupted the coloring pattern.
Boaz1 wrote:
Thu Jan 04, 2018 11:36 pm
Heard back from Wisdom on Boaz' s results.
I think it's great that Wisdom is offering up decent customer service. Sometimes that difficult to find from web-based services.

Also, it sounds like their response reinforces my opinion regarding the rareness and mix of breed affecting the accuracy of the results.
Michael
The pack -> Radar (DS), Leela (Mal?), and Karen (Human) - Cutler Bay, FL USA
RIP: Tequila and Snickers
If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went. - Will Rogers

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