Hip and Elbow xrays for OFA, opinions wanted :)

[DSGirl]

I had my Dutchie Gage xrayed yesterday for hips and elbows to be sent to OFA, I am hoping some members on here might be able to tell me what they think about how they look and positioning. Thanks everyone

[Raven]

Moved thread to Medical.

[DSGirl]

Ok, thanks. Sorry I wasn't sure where to post the thread. Thanks again.

[LyonsFamily]

I'll only comment on the hips. Elbows are difficult to read and I'll leave that one to a veterinary radiologist.

For positioning, I'd like to see the knees more even and the legs pulled out more and rotated to be perfect for OFA submission. The pelvis does look symmetrical though, and your boy is very slim, so that might affect it. Were these done with sedation or while awake? I don't see any reason why OFA would deny these though and you should be able to get a pretty accurate reading from them. I've seen way worse sent in to OFA that came back with accurate results compared to the prelims and follow ups. Both heads are seated well, the left head looks slightly better than the right.

My main concern would be shape of the greater trochanter and lack of depth with the trochanteric fossa. On the left hip, the t.f. looks like there's something missing too. The view of these may also be a result of not rotating the legs enough, or an exposure problem, but I just don't know enough about the anatomy of that part of the femor to give any insights other than it looks "off". If you're on facebook, the group Canine Health, Breeding and Puppy Care has a wide variety of breeders, vets, and techs that will give insight. Be warned, many members are harsh and appear rude, and there are a few people that say every x-ray is horrible positioning, and take their opinions as what they are, but you will get good feedback from the masses.

[DSGirl]

Thanks, these were done under sedation. I am curious how him being slim would affect the xrays? Just wondering. This boy has always been slim, to the point of driving my nuts. I will look into the group on facebook, thanks for the recommendation.

[Raven]

Steph, so hip rays taken in that position are/can be done without sedation? My last girl was sedated for them, and while they had to do that or she'd have ripped their faces off, the vet said to get the position you need, it's very uncomfortable for the dog, and because of the discomfort (and the manipulating and need for stillness, etc.), it's done under sedation.

Also, if there's a suspected issue to cause the x-rays to get taken (instead of only certifying health), is that automatic sedation? (I'm thinking in regard to: increased pain during procedure, etc.)

[LyonsFamily]

Thanks, these were done under sedation. I am curious how him being slim would affect the xrays? Just wondering. This boy has always been slim, to the point of driving my nuts. I will look into the group on facebook, thanks for the recommendation.

If he's slim, there's not much padding between the legs like in some dogs, so the legs would be closer together. It doesn't affect the score or anything, just that the legs won't be as far apart and even with pulling them out farther, there might be more pelvic overlap like is shown in this picture when compared to a dog with more "junk in the trunk". I've seen that with a lot of Vizslas and skinny sporting dogs.

Sharon, x-rays can be done with or without sedation. Which one is better is a huge debate and you'll get opinions on either side. For a quick diagnostic x-ray, it's easy to do without sedation in many dogs, especially if there isn't a ton of pain. I did 3 this week at the clinic and we didn't sedate. Those were small dogs though, and none were to be sent in to OFA. It is not standard procedure to sedate for any x-rays at the clinic I'm at now. With digital x-rays now, it's easier to not sedate than before since it can be redone and viewed quickly.


Odin was partially sedated when I got his diagnostic ones done. They just did pre-meds. We didn't get perfect positioning, but I got the answer I needed to treat him medically. Had I done it for OFA, I would've completely sedated him to get perfect positioning, but I was planning on redoing them in a year or so anyway, and didn't want to over expose him to the anesthesia.

Some critics think that sedating a dog moves the hips into an unnatural position and can actually force the dog to look worse since a dog doesn't naturally stand or move sedated. For a dog like yours and many Dutch Shepherds, sedating is the only option since they're not often fond of strangers positioning them in weird places. Like you mentioned, it's also good to sedate if the dog is in a lot of noticeable pain and sometimes it's impossible to get in position if the dog is tense from the pain.

Geneva, please keep us updated to what OFA says about the hips. I'm really interested to see what is being graded for this breed. I'm used to my own English Setter results and haven't sent in ones for a DS of my own yet.

[Raven]

Some critics think that sedating a dog moves the hips into an unnatural position and can actually force the dog to look worse since a dog doesn't naturally stand or move sedated.

Interesting. Never thought of that, but it makes sense...at least in general instances...but makes me wonder why that position is chosen--is another position more reliable yet able to support the opinion the this position is unnatural while getting information a vet needs? (Kind of like childbirth on the back: the OBs are the Johnny Bench's of the medical field for convenience while a woman giving birth on her back fights gravity.)

For a dog like yours and many Dutch Shepherds, sedating is the only option since they're not often fond of strangers positioning them in weird places. Like you mentioned, it's also good to sedate if the dog is in a lot of noticeable pain and sometimes it's impossible to get in position if the dog is tense from the pain.

Mmmm...my girl was in pain. Final stages and chewed up from cancer. But even with Thor, who's wicked healthy, I might be able to get him in that awkward position, but vet staff sure couldn't without full sedation.

Thanks for sharing the sides to the coin.

[DSGirl]

Well the results are back and his hips Scored Good and his elbows are Normal

[alspyce]

Great news!