Dutch Shepherd Forum

Hi! So, I've been thinking of adding a large breed dog to my family for quite awhile. Having just graduated the police academy, I've finally got the time, so I've been perusing the local classified ads, trying to find an older puppy or adult dog that suited me.

I ran across an ad that was selling an obedience trained German Shepherd for only $300. She was being sold by some guy who does obedience training and protection training for civilians in the next city over. I went over to see her, but she was sold by the time I got there.

However, I saw this gorgeous brindle dog that looked like a cross between a malinois and a German Shepherd. I asked about him and learned he was a Dutch Shepherd. The trainer let me meet him and he seemed like a fantastic dog...he seemed very stable, let me come right up to him and pet him, etc. The trainer demonstrated his protection training, and I was amazed that such a friendly dog was capable of such fierceness. Afterwards, the dog came right up to me as if he just hadn't tried to take my face off.

Turns out the guy contracts with a breeder. I guess he co-owns the male and female, and sells the puppies. It looks like he produces about one litter a year. The dog I had met was a full brother to the puppies he was selling.

I paid the deposit, and picked up my puppy one week later. The poor thing! He didn't want to go near me...absolutely cowered at the end of his tie-out and hid in his dog house. The trainer told me that the puppies had not been socialized. At all. They barely had human contact and had never been inside a house before. I'm kind of soft-hearted, and I couldn't leave the poor thing, so I wound up paying for him and taking him home.

So, now I've got a completely unsocialized Dutch Shepherd puppy who's got an apparent upper respiratory infection and is going to the vet tomorrow. I had to leave him at the boyfriends for two days, because he's got a fenced yard, and the puppy absolutely freaked out when we tried to bring him inside. He's getting much better, now. He's happy to hang out inside in his wire crate, he's somewhat comfortable on a leash, and he and Dixie are getting along halfway decently. I've only had him for four days. Obviously, I'm going to have a lot of work in front of me...any advice on where to start? Ideally, I was planning on him and I learning schutzhund together, but I worry that he might not be able to overcome his rough start in life.

Also, I wonder if he's a bit older than 16 weeks. It looks like almost all his adult teeth are in (a couple are halfway in), and he weighs close to 40 lbs. Any idea how old he is?

Anyways, sorry about the long post, and thanks for all your help

Hi and welcome to the forum.

Congrats on your new pup, but sounds like a bit of a surprise for you on what you got. Sorry to hear that.

bamacop wrote: Turns out the guy contracts with a breeder. I guess he co-owns the male and female, and sells the puppies. It looks like he produces about one litter a year. The dog I had met was a full brother to the puppies he was selling.

I paid the deposit, and picked up my puppy one week later. The poor thing! He didn't want to go near me...absolutely cowered at the end of his tie-out and hid in his dog house. The trainer told me that the puppies had not been socialized. At all. They barely had human contact and had never been inside a house before. I'm kind of soft-hearted, and I couldn't leave the poor thing, so I wound up paying for him and taking him home.

So, now I've got a completely unsocialized Dutch Shepherd puppy who's got an apparent upper respiratory infection and is going to the vet tomorrow.

I don't get it...the guys a trainer who co-owns dogs he breeds that are not socialized?? Sounds a little sketchy to me.

And they have a littler once a year? Yikes!

Yeah...he said that the breeder normally socializes his dogs quite well, but the breeder's house was hit by the tornadoes last year, and he was too busy with rebuilding to spend any time socializing them. Which I think is a ridiculous excuse, because the tornadoes were a full year ago. Why even breed a litter if you know you're going to be too busy to take care of them correctly? Of course, he didn't tell me this at all until after I had paid a nonrefundable deposit. I'd have just walked away minus the deposit, but the puppy was so pathetic. I kinda felt bad for the little guy. And the two littermates I met were as friendly as could be, after he worked with them for a couple of weeks, so I thought he'd come along nicely. So far, he has. It'd be a bit easier if he was feeling better, though

Thankfully, he's not aggressive in the slightest, even though everything (cars, houses, traffic, people, etc) is pretty new to him. I'd kind of understand if he fear-snapped at me, but he's done nothing of the sort.

I'll give you a ton of credit, Rita, for taking on an obviously challenged puppy.

If all his adult teeth are in, then he's gotta be around 6 months old. That would fit his weight better, too (a 16 week old puppy won't weigh 40 lbs).

If I were you, I'd start with socialization, socialization, and then if you have some extra time, some socialization . He needs to be exposed to everything you can think of, both in your own home, and out in the world. If he acts scared of anything, don't coddle him at all; just be very matter-of-fact.

I'd also work a lot on engagement...get him interacting with you for treats, and also, in play. And, make everything as fun as you possibly can.

When you get him playing with you and being happy about it, when you take him into a new environment, just play with him there. He'll learn that the environment is irrelevant; if you're there, there is fun afoot, and the newness of the environment won't matter.

I'll be eager to hear your stories!

Thankfully, my mini Aussie, Dixie, is fairly well trained and absolutely loves me. He seemed to be more comfortable with me when he saw that she was OK with being around me.

My boyfriend fell in love with him, too...he spent the better part of a day luring him into the house with handfuls of treats.

I'm just trying to get him used to the routine of being a house dog...crating, walks on leash, the noise of traffic nearby. When he's over his little upper respiratory infection (he's got some discharge in his eye, and his breathing is kinda noisy at times - going to the vet tomorrow), and he's used to the routine, then we'll start with walks in the park and meeting friendly people. At least, that's the plan. Even if he doesn't have the ability to learn schutzhund, I at least want to make sure he is a stable, friendly pet.

On the plus side, no accidents in the house yet!

Hi!
Congrats on your new puppy!
I dont have any advice not mentioned before, I only want to stress out once again not to comfort him when he`s afraid or stressed. Just ignore him, show him with your body language that everything is ok, nothing to be afarid of, and then treat when he is calm.

good luck, and I`m looking forward for your updates!


P.S.
What I do when Olaf is afraid of some safe things in our walks (like strange bushes, statues etc.) is, i go back to the object, slowly, but confidently, encourage him to follow me, and than touch the object, move it around etc so that he sees that its "only" a statue (or whatever). When he is ok with it, we go on with our walk.
I noticed this really works for him, he is less frightened of stuff on each walk.
i just want to stress out: he is afraid, but he trusts me and follows me. he never blocks out, want to run away from me, shakes his head to take of collar etc. I wouldnt recommend forcing a puppy into "facing his fears".
good luck!

Hi! I probably would have done the same and brought the puppy home. I hate seeing dogs tied up outside, anyway. I'll bet that given some time he'll be a great dog. I think having a previous dog will help a lot. You already noticed that he's watching your interactions with the Aussie. Good luck! Keep us updated. I'm probably the minority here, but except for some puppy classes and a basic manners class, I don't do much training with my dogs until they are a year old. Sit Down Stay and Walk Nice is about it.

Id probably have brought him home too. But I do agree that it is odd that the pups didnt have any socialization. But no matter. Dont push him too hard, let him check things out at his own pace, like the others said, dont make a big deal out of anything and just go about your day and let him learn from you. Can you leave the house door open and let him come and check it out on his own? Maybe fence of the kitchen or what ever room the door comes in and let him just get comfy there. I agree with Carol about waiting to do anything other than regular stuff. After having a young DS pup I noticed that as she approached a year her mental stability really took off ( although she still runs into walls).

Now........ we need some pictures!!!

Agree about the socialization, not coddling when afraid, just act matter-of-fact because he will play on your emotions also. What I find helpful is having another dog who is social and knows the home routine (my own Aussie), bringing both dogs on outings, etc. When I bring in boarders for training, my Aussie makes my job so much easier. They just fall into his routine and voila! Good luck with your pup.

I found something that can be usefull to you:

http://labradornet.com/kennelsyndrome.html

I've found that sometimes the ones who take so much extra work, are the ones who eventually turn out to be on the "Favorites" list here. (I seem to be a magnet for the hard luck dogs.) Good luck, and don't get discouraged.

http://labradornet.com/kennelsyndrome.html

The other link wasnt working, just in case it wasnt working for any one else, I re-posted the link.

Hopefully, she's not as bad as that website describes. Dogs can overcome fears. I already wrote something about my first dog, Doerak. He was a kennel dog before I got him, and he would shy from a lot of the everyday noises that we don't even think about, mostly kitchen noises,and loud traffic. He turned out great and I really loved that dog. I think it made our bond greater because he trusted me so much, yet he was able to be brave when called upon.

I recently had a DS rescue in my house for a week. He was terrified of me at first. He had gone from his original home, to a shelter and then to my house. Once I was able to get him out of my car by, literally, dragging him out with a 20 foot leash. I let him stay in the kitchen where he could watch everything me and my dogs did while I ignored him. By the end of the evening, I was able to walk into the kitchen if I didn't look at him. And all his potty breaks were on the same 20 foot leash. I never tried to approach him, but I let him decide when he was ready. By the end of the week he was my best friend. Of course, he was older, but the same treatment would apply.

Are there photos? Did I miss them?

It is great that you were willing to take on such challenge, Rita. But at the same time, it makes me mad just reading about what was unloaded on you. A six month old with no socialisation is not likely ever going to do well in schutzhund. So if I understand correctly, your pup was 'shipped' in to the person you met from the 'breeder' that he had a contract with? I'd love to hear the names of either/both of these con artists.

I received my dutch shepherd when he was about 3 months and he had not be socialized. As others on the forum know, he was actually crated so long his legs had started to grow bent. When I first got him, he limped and walking fast was not even an option. Now he is almost a year old and the best dog I have ever had. He gets along with most people and other dogs that we introduced him to, stray dogs set him off, but he even became friends with a cat! He loves my son who is 5 and is very willing to please. He is very active and can run like the wind I'm sure, with time, your pup will open up to you and become the dog you want him to be. It's amazing how fast my Merlin came around, the people here are very good with advice and very helpful. Good luck, Im sure you will be happy with your pup, even with the situation he came from. Ohhhh and we love pictures!!!!

I'm not suggesting for a moment that Rita shouldn't work hard with this young pup and it will no doubt end up being the best it can be, given it's beginnings and genetics. And, who knows? It could just overcome it all.

However, there is a big difference between a 3 month old and a 6 month old, just in terms of critical periods.

I think anyone who rescues any animal rocks, period.

what a story Good luck with the pup (did I miss his name??) and I hope all your efforts will turn him into a nice social dog afterall! Sounds like he found a nice home

Just wanted to update y'all....

He's really turning into quite the dog! He's a bit shy when meeting new people, but I can take him to the dog park and PetSmart without him freaking out (you can tell that he's a bit uncomfortable, but he's a good sport). He's actually kind of indifferent to most people besides me...I can't tell if that's his lack of socialization, or more of a breed characteristic.

No one believes me when I tell them he wasn't socialized for the first 6 months of his life

I just wish there were more places I could take him that are "dog friendly".

Thats fantastic!!! Just keep doing what you are doing. Some of the Home Depot's and Leows I can take Thalie into and havent had anyone complain but others have so you could try

Great news, Rita, and great work!