Dutch Shepherd Forum

About 3 years ago we adopted a sweet neglected 2 year old dog from the dog shelter. She is a dog full of personality and challenges but she is also an extremely loyal and wonderful dog. When we adopted her we were told she was mixed with German Shepard but that is all we were told. After looking into her size and coloring I find it hard to think she is actually a German Shepard and was hoping maybe someone on this site could help point in me a better direction?


For what it is worth - she also has a spotted tongue...!

how big is she? i cannot tell from the photo. weight, height at shoulders?
can you tell us a bit about that wonderful personality and some of the challenges that go with it?

I personally don't see Dutch at all. Perhaps some Keeshond to explain the coloring and head shape mixed with the GSD to give some lankyness to the body and the shorter hair. I'm thinking mainly GSD, they do come in a variety of colors and sizes. The first pick looks very GSD, but standing and profile pics of the entire dog would be more helpful.

LyonsFamily wrote:Perhaps some Keeshond to explain the coloring and head shape mixed with the GSD to give some lankyness to the body and the shorter hair.

Keeshond was exactly my first thought...

and i thought the type of GSD - assuming there is some in there [???] - would be Czech, which would also be a better match coloring wise than other GSDs

johninny wrote:and i thought the type of GSD - assuming there is some in there [???] - would be Czech, which would also be a better match coloring wise than other GSDs

What I think you mean by this is the color pattern that's commonly associated with Czech lines? It can show up in German and American lines as well and is referred to as sable. I would doubt that there are actual Czech lines, but the sable GSD pattern is pretty likely.

Also, I retract the statement about Keeshond. I was thinking along the lines of Keeshond and Elkhound would be a much better match.

i had never heard of czech line til recently. [ NONE of this stuff is my strong suit, so... ] she used to train them for patrolling the east/west border prior to coming to usa in '68 [the Prague spring: she was here for a wedding when the invasion occurred and never went back --- and i was in prague til 2 days before ]. anyway, she said they are SO different and so distinct from their German german brothers., so showed me photos and indeed they were quite different - and many with this coloration and soft/subtle pattern which i had not seen in GSDs before. [ i thought sable was the large black saddle like pattern. what does sable refer to? if you have the time to educate me. ] also the Czech German-Shepherds seemed more compact to me [ less long and a bit more sturdy looking].

are you sure you do not want to move to Long Island, Stephanie? sorely need a good dog professional out here. unfortunately, area is short on other things, too, like no dock diving anywhere - unless you use a real dock in a bay!

johninny wrote:i had never heard of czech line til recently. [ NONE of this stuff is my strong suit, so... ] she used to train them for patrolling the east/west border prior to coming to usa in '68 [the Prague spring: she was here for a wedding when the invasion occurred and never went back --- and i was in prague til 2 days before ]. anyway, she said they are SO different and so distinct from their German german brothers., so showed me photos and indeed they were quite different - and many with this coloration and soft/subtle pattern which i had not seen in GSDs before. [ i thought sable was the large black saddle like pattern. what does sable refer to? if you have the time to educate me. ] also the Czech German-Shepherds seemed more compact to me [ less long and a bit more sturdy looking].

are you sure you do not want to move to Long Island, Stephanie? sorely need a good dog professional out here. unfortunately, area is short on other things, too, like no dock diving anywhere - unless you use a real dock in a bay!

All we use are real docks here. It's 2 hours to the nearest dock diving facility. There's a boat launch with a ramp and dock very close to regulation that we play on down the street. That's most of the reason Odin has trouble going into the pool when we do venture out to a practice place as he's only used to real lakes. Long Island isn't out of the question yet lol. We still haven't closed on the house. Everything is still in limbo, so if it falls through we might just take the down payment money and run.

Here's a chart that may help you out. http://inumonogatari.files.wordpress.co ... colors.jpg I'm not 100% fluent in color genetics and every kennel club calls things something different, but this chart would show a dog like the OP's as a silver sable. The only litter I've helped produce was from my English Setters and it's pretty straight forward with them, they were both orange beltons and we got all orange beltons. You get orange belton, blue belton or tri colored with setters. Belton referring to the spotting. The other colors are all just varying shades of each other. I know far less about Shepherds than a lot of the breeders on here, so they could possibly be more help with that.

GSD genetics are all over the place with the different lines and such, that we're seeing dogs that, in my opinion, should be now classified as different breeds all together under the original GSD title. If you want an interesting education, read up on the supposedly new color/pattern of the Panda Shepherds. There's a lot of debate in that area, but comparing that dog to some of the other German Shepherds including Czech and DDR lines seems a big stretch for single breed variety.

The only reason why I am hesitant to suggest this dog was a Czech shepherd is because those lines are similarly limitedd like the DS and that they just don't have a ton of mixes out there plus the temperament isn't something usually suitable for every day pet homes, much like the KNPV bred DS. . The head shape, from the OP's pic, also suggests a different breed, so I was attributing the rest of the size to that as well.

I did find a picture of an elkhound/GSD cross online, ironically named Odin. http://imgur.com/rhwSz and another http://www.dogster.com/dogs/28667

wow, thanks Stephanie! i like the other Odin you found. i agree completely that IF there is any GSD in this dog that it is just part of the story. and OK, who could resist looking into panda shepherds - can't wait to see this.

Hi there, nice looking dog. I noticed Keeshond was listed as a possible mix, might also look at some of the Norwegian Elkhound / shepherd mixes. Not all get the curly tail. Also, there may be multiple breeds in the mix. You might look up the "Silver Malinois" picture that is on this forum also. Thanks for sharing your dog.

Sorry for the delayed response. Zoe is 29 kgs (roughly 63 lbs) and though I am not sure her exact height she stands just above knee high at the shoulders. She is a fiercely loyal dog. We have two young kids and at the dog park she is always between them and other dogs until she feels it to be a safe situation. She loves swimming - more just the retrieval of a stick but will go great lengths and for hours. We run her in the mountains/back roads - we take the truck and can go 60 km/h with her keeping up. She is also a jumper - she can easily get out of 6 foot high enclosures and recently scaled a 9 foot high fence at the kennel she was staying at. She does have the curled tail and her ears are always upright. She loves playing in the snow but will not step foot outside during the rain. She has huge separation anxiety - all of our windows have been re-screened due to her jumping through them while we were out (after recently getting her) - she has also had to have dental surgery as she chewed through a metal crate and broke one of her teeth doing so. I will try to find/take better photos of her. Her coat is a silver black mix with the very top of her back being a solid black stripe. Short soft coat. Any thing else I can tell you about her?

Did I mention she is *amazing* with kids??

I am at a total loss, but she sure is beautiful and great with the children !

"I think there is a Mal in there."

I agree. The side profile looks all mslinois. And mals come in sale also.

don't see Malinois or Dutch Shepherd. GSD mix?