Dutch Shepherd Forum

I realize that I don't understand this well. The way I thought it was is that a KNPV DS is bred for work (vs. conformation) and can have malinois liberally interbred (still?). Are there KNPV lines of malinois as distinct from KNPV DS? Or are they all the same designation. And while I read that at times long ago, like before the 1940s there was some interbreeding of GSD but that does not happen any longer. True? Is KNPV limited to the dS and malinois? That is, no KNPV GSD?

If anyone can set me straight I would appreciate it.

KNPV is a sport/certifying/titling program and is used to determine breeding stock and prove working ability. KNPV titles are respresented by the PH1, PH2, etc on pedigrees. It's similar to Schutzhund or French Ring. They're not a stud book like FCI is and it's not breed specific. They don't track pedigrees.

I'm not sure exactly what your question is, but there are Malinois, GSD, Groenendaels, and other working breeds with KNPV titles in addition to Dutch Shepherds. KNPV is a Dutch program in that it's in the country of Holland, but it's not just for Dutch Shepherds. KNPV dogs are bred for their working abilities, so "purebred" pedigree doesn't matter. KNPV bred dogs in the US are dogs that have lines that go back to KNPV titled dogs.

I'm not sure logistically how someone enters a dog for KNPV stuff as a Dutch Shepherd and what the criteria are, but I've heard comments about it just needing to be a brindle shepherd. I think it's similar to entering CPE or K9 Nosework where the owners just identify the dog's breed, but don't need to have papers or official stud book registrations. I've heard that great danes, gsds, am staffs, and groendaels have been crossed in KNPV DS lines as well to produce better working dogs. I think Christie mentioned somewhere she had a DS female with a throwback head from a Groendael.

Thanks Stephanie.

So a DS of KNPV lines comes from breeding programs that emphasize performance in the KNPV program. Is it true that these DS have a greater likelihood of having other breeds bred in... especially the malinois but maybe others? Is it or was it less regulated than FCI?

I ask because on another forum there was a picture of a KNPV DS that sure looked like rottweiler and maybe pit bull was mixed in.

Thanks just learn'in.

Karin, Gingerman [ in ''is my canine a DS'' ] has just posted a link to a 2-page DS history that briefly talks very clearly about FCI vs KNPV in general [ not DS-centric ] --- at least, i enjoyed reading it. sounds like that knpv dog you saw would be better described as a knpv-brindle-thing-dog than a DS [??].

Karin wrote:Is it or was it less regulated than FCI?

From my understanding, KVPV is not regulated at all for lineage. There's no check or requirement of pedigrees, so that would lead to a greater amount of different breeds bred in. There could possibly be a pitt or rott mixed in somewhere, I've heard of pitts mixed in before, but haven't found a pedigree showing it.

FCI has open stud books still in some countries, but there's a process for registration and for the most part the majority of the lines are a great deal "pure" for many generations.

My Elli is from KNPV lines. I'm pretty sure this is her pedigree, from what her original owner sent me. Pedigree Database isn't always accurate, and it's not complete on her mom's size, but it'll give you a general idea. If you look at the sire, there are mals back a few generations, but the majority of the mals and DS have KNPV titles. I guess both parents were able to get UKC registered, and so was Elli's litter, but they are not FCI registered.
http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/breedin ... er=1859004